Metropolitan status for Bermuda is a complete `red herring'', Finance Minister the Hon. David Saul told the House of Assembly on Friday.

The British Government had stated on at least three occasions that they were not going to make any commitment to Bermuda post-1997 because it would be "pure hypothesis'', he said.

Opposition Leader Mr. Frederick Wade had said the British Government had been ambiguous about Bermuda's status after 1997 when Hong Kong was returned to Chinese rule.

Dr. Saul jokingly chided Mr. Wade for confusing the public with a myriad of red and green.

Dr. Saul also took Mr. Wade to task for declaring civil servants wrote up minutes before a meeting took place.

"This is another gross exaggeration.'' On Mr. Wade's call for the UBP to show leadership, Dr. Saul stressed the purpose of the Green Paper was to deliver an objective document setting out the facts, which could form the basis for discussion.

Now was not the time for the Government to say whether it was for or against going alone.

"The people of Bermuda are not interested in a child's game of `follow my leader','' he said.

Dr. Saul said the Green Paper -- produced by five Cabinet members with divergent views on Independence -- was not designed to be a Pulitzer Prize winner.

But nevertheless, said Dr. Saul, Mr. Wade had tacitly agreed it was a good document.

Dr. Saul said the PLP's approach to Independence was to have a general election in which the issue was one of a number of subjects in the party's platform.

"I did not hear in the statement from Mr. Wade, and I listened very carefully, that the PLP would have a referendum.

"That is the difference between the Government and the PLP. We believe in the common sense of Bermudians, and that is why we have a Green Paper, and then will be asking the public to make their comments.'' If Bermudians voted "no'' for Independence, Government would not press ahead.

If the answer was "yes'' Government would ensure the wishes of the people were carried out.

In concluding, Dr. Saul said the Green Paper was designed to lessen the anxieties of Bermudians.

He said there were 19,000 copies of it, and Government was giving people the chance to make up their own minds on the issue.

Shadow Labour Minister Mr. Alex Scott said Bermudians wanted Government to hammer out its position on Independence -- contrary to what Dr. Saul stated.

Government had to show leadership on such an important issue.

Mr. Scott said Premier the Hon. Sir John Swan was effectively asking Bermudians to "sign here and we will show you what you are getting later''.

"That makes people feel uneasy.'' Some people questioned why Independence should ever be contemplated, continued Mr. Scott.

But Independence was needed, he said, to free the "psychological detainees'' in Bermuda.

Mr. Scott went on to highlight the case of the Falklands War in 1982.

He said Britain embarked on that war to defend the interests of 2,000 Englishmen and women.

And after the conflict was over, the commander of the British forces declared "the B was now back in Britain''.

How different Britain reacted when presented with 6,000 signatures by Bermudians over the hiring of two UK Policemen.

In this case, Britain showed disregard for Bermudians' wishes.

"It was the wrong Bs, these were the Bs from Bermuda not Britain.'' Mr. Scott said it was essential to map out a short-term and long-term approach to Independence.

Bermuda should not go Independent to "bolster the career of one leader'', he said in reference to the Premier.

"It should not be done for any reason but to advance Bermuda constitutionally.'' Mr. Scott went on to quote from several newspaper articles which, he stated, highlighted the twists and turns and the disunity of Government on Independence.

On September 30, 1993, the Premier accused the PLP of having a "hidden agenda'', according to one report.

Lo and behold, after the election, Sir John Swan announced the issue of Independence behind closed doors to a meeting of international businessmen, said Mr. Scott, reading out another article.

"He had never mentioned the subject in Parliament.'' Sir John claimed to have put Independence on the agenda because of the proposed withdrawal of the British from HMS Malabar.

But this claim did not appear to hold water, said Mr. Scott.

He went on to read another article, in which the then Deputy Governor Mr. John Kelly accused Sir John of making "misleading'' comments.

Mr. Kelly was quoted as saying Sir John had had advance notice about the high likelihood of HMS Malabar closing within two years.

Said Mr. Scott: "If Government is to produce leadership, surely the public must expect leaders are together. They must believe there is solidarity on this, at least in the Cabinet.'' But this was not so, said Mr. Scott.

Another newspaper article, quoted Health Minister the Hon. Quinton Edness as ruling out an Independence referendum "in the near future''.

It was clear Mr. Edness was unaware of Sir John's intentions.

Mr. Scott, however, said the first time Sir John had mentioned Independence was not at the gathering of businessmen -- but in London at a meeting of dependent territories.

"Bermudians were the last people to hear about Independence,'' he charged.

It was also apparent the UBP Government was bitterly divided, said Mr. Scott.

Education Minister the Hon. Clarence Terceira , for instance, spoke of the alleged enormous cost of going Independence, according to a newspaper report.

And, in another article, a senator likened a UBP meeting on Independence to a "bar-room brawl''.

It was clear, said Mr. Scott, the UBP could not find a uniform approach to Independence.

And that is why Government had not shown leadership on the issue, and decided to have a referendum.

Mr. Scott went on to say it was obvious Britain had chosen their man to lead the Country to Independence -- Sir John Swan.

The British had selected not the UBP Government to do this, but Sir John as an individual, stressed Mr. Scott.

"This is the sort of behaviour by the British which has in the past brought turmoil,'' he said. "It is when they begin to lead a people to a course they may or may not wish that brings trouble to the process of moving from one Constitution to another.'' Bermuda should be very suspicious about the UBP Government on the Independence issue -- and this was demonstrated by the controversy over the hiring of two British Policemen, said Mr. Scott.

"You don't go Independent and bring in two British bobbies. If they were really in favour of change they wouldn't have hired them.'' Mr. Scott, picking up a phrase from his colleague Shadow Sport Minister Dr.

Ewart Brown , described the UBP Government has "Johnnie come latelies'' to the Independence issue.

For the Premier to use Malabar as an excuse for cutting ties with the UK sounded very "hollow''.

"It sounds a little thin. It does not carry much weight.'' Mr. Scott warned that Bermuda could not expect a fair hearing at any Constitutional conference in London.

"I would want us to go armed with the support and vote of confidence of the populace.'' That was why the PLP wanted Independence to be decided by a general election.

Why must Bermuda take the referendum route, when everywhere else in the Commonwealth had plumped for an election? Mr. Scott said the PLP had been consistent since its first manifesto in 1963 in backing Independence.

It was wrong for the media to make out the 1993 platform had not mentioned it.

The party's position on the issue was outlined on the back page.

"We save the best for last,'' quipped Mr. Scott.

This contrasted starkly with the UBP which dropped no hint of Independence in the Blueprint.

Taking a potshot at Sir John, Mr. Scott said Independence was raised to "resuscitate a failing political career''.

On the other hand, the PLP nurtured Independence like a child, believing it would pull blacks and whites together.

Independence was not an issue which should be decided on cost, said Mr. Scott.

The British did not argue about cost when they sent a task force to the South Atlantic to take back the Falklands.

Mr. Scott returned to the PLP's visit to London, and the meeting with Mr. Tony Baldry.

Shadow Finance Minister Mr. Eugene Cox and Mr. Wade had gone there in good faith.

After initially telling them he would come to Bermuda in April to clarify Britain's position on Independence, Mr. Baldry wrote back to say the visit had been called off.

"It seemed the shifting political sands had moved under Anthony's feet,'' remarked Mr. Scott.

Britain, said Mr. Scott, had obviously begun to feel uncomfortable and decided to "pitch in'' with Sir John.

Mr. Scott read out a passage from a March 15 letter from Mr. Baldry to Mr.

Wade: "I think the question of an election following a yes vote in a referendum must be a matter for the Government of the day.

"You may wish to explore this further with the Government of Bermuda either before or during a Constitutional Conference.'' Mr. Scott also noted how Mr. Baldry had urged the two PLP MPs to throw their weight behind the two UK Policemen Mr. Colin Coxall and Mr. Michael Mylod.

He said Mr. Baldry could be assured the two would not be forgotten by the PLP.

Important questions needed to be asked, such as the relationship between Governor Lord Waddington and Mr. Coxall.

It seemed to be a case of two old friends getting together in Bermuda.

Lord Waddington appeared to have said to Mr. Coxall: "Come out to the colony, the water's fine.'' Mr. Scott finished his speech by turning to the dual nationality issue.

He said the Green Paper made it clear the UBP Government wanted to ship Bermudians out of the Country whenever the economy was in poor shape.

Transport Minister the Hon. Maxwell Burgess accused Mr. Scott of allowing his imagination to run away from him.

Picking up on an aside by Government backbencher Mr. John Barritt , Mr.

Burgess said Mr. Scott appeared to be quoting from "Alex in Wonderland''.

He denied the UBP had attempted to trick or deceive the public on Independence.

Mr. Burgess said it was right to expect Government at the right time to give its position on such Independence issues as staying in the Commonwealth and the future of the judiciary.

But it would be putting "the cart before the horse'' to give those opinions now.

This debate was on the Green Paper, which was a discussion document.

"I haven't met one person who says he doesn't want more information on Independence,'' he said.

Mr. Burgess criticised the PLP call for Independence to be decided by a general election.

What would happen if both political parties supported Independence? A person who was anti-Independence would be forced into the position of not voting, said Mr. Burgess.

Mr. Burgess also took the PLP to task for stating, by taking the referendum route, Sir John Swan could forge a form of Independence at the Constitutional conference which nobody wanted.

This could equally be said about deciding Independence by a general election.

Mr. Burgess then attacked the PLP for suggesting the Premier and the United Kingdom were in cahoots in forming their own form of Independence.

"I think it is clearly wrong and preposterous.'' Mr. Burgess said, should Bermuda go Independent, it would not go through the same transition period as many other former dependent territories.

Bermuda had been running its own affairs for many years, and had been responsible for the public purse.

It now had an economy which was the envy of the world.

And should the Country go Independent, Finance Minister the Hon. David Saul could be expected to produce another Budget, in the normal way.

"Historically Bermudians have managed themselves frugally.'' Mr. Burgess said the UBP Government had a good track record in managing the affairs of the Country.

"I have no reason to believe, if Bermuda decides to go Independent, Government would take leave of its senses and scare international business and tourism away.'' On the question of costs, Mr. Burgess said Government had been very careful in providing figures.

"We erred on the upward side of rounding off figures.'' Mr. Burgess said it was wrong for the PLP to allege that the UBP had not given leadership on Independence.

The fact was the UBP wanted to let Bermudians decide the issue.

And, on the question of dual citizenship, it was also incorrect for Mr. Scott to make out Government intended driving Bermudians away from these shores whenever there was a recession.

Government, in the Green Paper, was merely holding out the option for Bermudians to use their dual citizenship by working overseas.

It would never suggest forcing Bermudians out of the Country.

Mr. Burgess went on to say the PLP had tried to preempt Government's Independence initiative by going to London to see Mr. Baldry.

He was sympathetic to the PLP attempt to thwart any referendum, but it had failed.

In concluding, Mr. Burgess said it was extremely important for the Independence debate to be carried out dispassionately.

MPs should desist from becoming emotional.

"The Green Paper is a factual and good discussion paper.'' Shadow Finance Minister Mr. Eugene Cox strongly defended the speeches of Mr.

Wade and Mr. Scott.

Mr. Cox said it was wrong for Mr. Burgess to impugn Mr. Scott's motives and engage in "character assassination''.

Mr. Scott had been quite justified in calling into question Government's intentions on dual citizenship as outlined in the Green Paper.

The Green Paper used the phrase "safety valve'' in connection with Bermudians gaining employment overseas during hard economic times.

Mr. Cox, who concentrated on the socio-economic aspects of Independence, went on to try to shoot down claims going it alone was too costly.

He said Independence would increase Bermuda's competitive edge because people would have a greater sense of self-interest.

People would be encouraged to participate in the Country's affairs.

Mr. Cox said the legal status of the Bermuda Monetary Authority would not been changed by cutting ties with Britain.

In fact, added Mr. Cox, there would probably be moves to strengthen the BMA.

Mr. Cox said if an Independent Bermuda belonged to such international agencies as the OECD it would be bound by certain agreements.

Mr. Cox turned to fears that Independence would lead to a dimunition of Bermuda's British atmosphere.

This was nonsense, since Parliament, the Regiment, and the Police would continue much as they do today.

The Regiment would not start behaving as if it was Austrian. "It is foolish to think all this will evaporate.'' Mr. Cox said it was likewise foolish to be believe Independence would destroy international business.

That was a "fictitious concern'', and flew in the fact of the fact that Bermuda had created the environment for international businesses to prosper.

Mr. Cox said a PLP Government would recognise the value of overseas businesses.

"It does not make sense for us to destroy everything we tried to build.'' He also pointed out PLP MPs did not have overseas investments like their UBP counterparts.

That meant they would not take flight should the Country hit hard times. They had a vested interest in Bermuda.

"The PLP would stay here.'' Mr. Cox turned to the price of Independence and said, by his own calculations, it could cost about $2.32 per week per person.

That was less than the cost of a packet of cigarettes.

"The question of cost has been inflated,'' he said.

Mr. Cox said the PLP's position on Independence was clear.

"We want Independence, but we do not want to foist Independence on the people.'' He emphasised, however, that democracy was incompatible with colonialism.

"We should be yearning to go to Independence. Every man, women and child should want to go to Independence.'' PLP against Independence approach But, said Mr. Cox, the PLP opposed the way the Premier had gone about Independence.

"The Blueprint did not declare any intention of going Independent.'' Ironically, the Government, prior to the last general election, had accused the Opposition of wanting to lead the Country to Independence and bring in income tax.

What had happened, however? Mr. Cox said Government had introduced income tax -- which is what the new payroll tax is -- capital gains tax, and now an Independence initiative.

Bermudians had to ask themselves whether they could believe in the UBP Government.

When Mr. Cox and Mr. Wade visited British Cabinet Minister Mr. Tony Baldry in London, he seemed "taken aback'' at the prospect of Bermuda going to Independence before a general election, Mr. Cox said. He said he would research the issue and report back. Mr. Baldry later "changed his tune'' after pressure was put on him to support the Governor, Mr. Cox said. He wrote back saying it would be a matter for the Government of the day to decide.

Health and Social Services Minister the Hon. Quinton Edness said the Green Paper debate was probably the most important one MPs would take part in for the next 50 years. He said the Green Paper was "a very good document''. Many felt things would be better in Bermuda "if we have a clear, independent identity,'' he said.

"Many Bermudians feel the time has come when we can in fact govern ourselves, look after ourselves, and become an entity without colonial status in this world.'' The Green Paper laid out the issues, and at a later date the Government would spell out its position on the various issues.

Bermuda would continue to be stable after Independence. And should the PLP become the Government, "why should they do something to destabilise this particular country?'' he asked. "It's not going to happen.'' It was the UBP that had caused Independence to be explored at various times over the years, Mr. Edness said. And while it did not appear in the party's last election manifesto, it only made the last page of the PLP's platform.

Mr. Wade, in spelling out the PLP's position on Independence issues, disagreed with using a referendum to decide constitutional change. But Mr. Edness felt it might make sense for some issues -- like the right of appeal to the Privy Council -- to require not only a two-thirds majority in Parliament, but approval in a plebiscite.

Mr. Edness disagreed with former Premier the Hon. Sir David Gibbons when he suggested matters like appeal to the Privy Council, which were entrenched in the Constitution, could be easily changed after Independence.

"This is where there is an insult to Bermudians,'' he said. "For anybody to try to subtly put that sort of thing in the Press to scare people off is very dangerous.'' "I hope Sir David reads that,'' interjected Mr. Ottiwell Simmons (PLP).

"Well I hope so, too,'' Mr. Edness said. "He should go back and read his own White Paper, which dealt with entrenchment.'' Metropolitan status after Hong Kong was returned to the Chinese in 1997 was not going to happen, Mr. Edness said. If it was going to happen, it would have happened already, since such arrangements had been made with the Falkland Islands and Gibraltar.

Bermuda had made great progress after its last constitutional move in 1968 and would grow "in leaps and bounds once we get rid of colonialism.'' A white Barbadian once told Mr. Edness that Independence had made that country "one people.'' "That's what will make this country great,'' Mr. Edness said. "That's what will stop all of the dissension and the animosity and the jealousy that takes place.'' Some non-Bermudians say, "I can always go back, you know,'' but that was an insult to Bermudians, Mr. Edness said. People who came to Bermuda to work should feel it was a wonderful country they were privileged to work in.

Contrary to what Mr. Wade said, Premier the Hon. Sir John Swan had no "secret agenda'' to enshrine the present constituency boundaries in the Constitution of an Independent Bermuda, Mr. Edness said.

But there were other ways to remove inequities than to do away with parish boundaries.

Mr. Edness said he resented hearing those who came from an Independent country, those who had companies in other Independent countries, or non-Bermudians generally saying that Bermuda should not be examining the issue.

"We cannot take away the right of the Bermudian people to decide their constitutional destiny.'' Mr. Ottiwell Simmons (PLP) said if every Government MP spoke as directly as Mr. Edness did, there would be less confusion.

"Bermuda should be a place for Bermudians, and all of the exempt companies would respect us for that,'' Mr. Simmons said. "They don't respect us when we go cap in hand and in a weak position.'' But that was the position of Government. Mr. Edness was "a break-away horse''.

For the ordinary man, Independence would make him feel like he owned something, "for the first time in his life'', Mr. Simmons said.

Bermudians did not own the businesses that formed the two pillars of the economy -- hotels and international companies. Nor did they own their own country.

Government was saying it wanted to hear the people's views on Independence simply because "they cannot get all their ducks in a row.'' Dependency was "a shame'' on Bermuda, and great feelings were stirred when countries like Ghana, Zimbabwe, Kenya, and Nigeria achieved Independence.

"There is nothing wrong with Independence,'' Mr. Simmons said.

"Everything is right with Independence. The people will be happy under Independence. The country will be a stable country under Independence.'' In fact, Mr. Simmons said there was more chance for instability as a dependent territory, when "your owner is some thousands of miles from you.'' "When you become your own owner, and determine your own destiny, then you become a mature, stable people.'' Mr. Simmons said Government should "stop the nonsense talk,'' and if some on the Government side would not support Independence, those who would support it should "join us'' and "let us take the Country where it should be''.

Mr. Simmons said he had been attending International Labour Organisation meetings in Geneva since 1963 and had gradually seen Bermuda's observer seats pushed from the middle of the room to near the door as newly-independent countries took the central seats. At the last meeting, Bermuda observers were "up against the door,'' which had to be locked so they would not fall out.

For the opening, "they would not even sit us in the conference room,'' Mr.

Simmons said. "They sat us in the public gallery.'' Dr. Ewart Brown (PLP) said the Green Paper was the idea of the PLP. While Government was describing the process as an attempt to bring democracy to Bermuda, the Opposition was not buying that, he said.

With 34,000 voters on the Island, why had only 19,000 copies of the Green Paper been sent out? Government should "come clean'' and admit Independence "could be the only way Government sees itself retaining power,'' Dr. Brown said.

Independence was "Plan B,'' for Government, which had previously described it as "poison pie,'' he said.

"This Government finds itself in an embarrassing predicament.'' In its effort to show the Country had a stable two-party system, Government was now speaking about the Opposition in different terms as well.

The PLP felt Independence was "great,'' Dr. Brown said. "All living things seek to be independent.'' Dr. Martin Luther King used to say there were two kinds of leadership -- one that reacted to consensus and one that helped to form it.

On a critical issue like Independence, Government had to help form consensus, Dr. Brown said. If Government could not take a position on the issue, "then maybe you are not the correct Government to take the Country to Independence.'' On the recent salary increase for Parliamentarians, "we didn't take it to the people,'' Dr. Brown said. "We increased our salaries and took what we call the leadership and initiative.

"Now we come to an issue as important as Independence, and we don't show any leadership.'' Dr. Brown said he had never seen an Independence movement that was so cold, emotionless, and corporate. "If you're not emotional about becoming Independent, then you don't deserve it,'' he said.

The debate continues today.