Conclusion of debate on Green Paper Shadow Works Minister Mr. Walter Roberts praised the Premier the Hon. Sir John Swan on Wednesday for making one of his "better speeches''.

For once Sir John was not attacking the Progressive Labour Party, he said.

There were, however, some flaws in the speech -- and a prominent one was the Premier's backing for private schools.

Mr. Roberts claimed schools had gone private because they did not want integration.

For instance, a lot of money -- not from Government -- had been pumped into making Saltus go private.

"It was understood they did not want to integrate.'' In addition, the former Premier the Hon. Sir John Sharpe was very much against integration at Warwick Academy.

Mr. Roberts said he did not see why Warwick should go private.

"The white community do not really want to be fully integrated with the black community. That is why so many whites don't want to go independent.'' Mr. Roberts said white people were opposed to Independence because they had nothing to reach for.

But unless enterprising blacks received the support they deserved, Bermuda was headed for more problems.

Mr. Roberts said one matter had to be sorted out before an Independence Constitutional conference -- electoral boundaries.

It was completely wrong for Sport Minister the Hon. Pamela Gordon to maintain Bermuda had equal rights, said Mr. Roberts.

This could not be true while people did not have votes of equal value.

In Paget West, for example, there were 1,217 voters, while in Warwick East there 2,440.

And yet both constituencies had the same number of seats. This did not make sense.

"Fundamental things have to be changed in the Island,'' said Mr. Roberts.

To go Independent without key changes in the Constitution would amount to selling Bermuda "down the tubes'', he added.

Mr. Roberts likened it to buying a tin with no label on.

"You don't know what you are going to get inside. You may be surprised. It could be solid gold, but as long as you don't know it's taking an awful chance.'' He added: "What amazes me is that there are more members in this House who really want Independence, and we may not get it. We are divided as to the method of getting Independence.'' Mr. Roberts asked why Sir John could not speak to Opposition Progressive Party leader Mr. Frederick Wade, and come to an agreement on method.

He suggested the reason was that Sir John had become frustrated with dealing with "Front Street'' and the right-wingers who spread doom and gloom about Independence. A referendum was a way out.

"I believe he feels this is the only way he can move his party down the road.'' Mr. Roberts likened his own growing up with Independence.

He pointed out he had got married at 21 and set up his own home, while still receiving the moral support of his parents.

"It is the same thing with Independence. Sooner or later we have got to grow up in this Country.

"We can't rely on mother to send a frigate whenever the natives get restless.

It is time we stood on our own two feet.'' Mr. Roberts said Bermuda had to rely on Britain for negotiating international treaties, air links and passports.

Currently, Bermudians had "BDTC'' on their passports, and it had been left to Britain to get them accepted.

"I am a BDTC, whatever that is. We don't even know who we are.'' On the question of internal security, Mr. Roberts said the Bermuda Regiment and the Police were prepared to deal with it.

And as regard external security, this was not something to be realistically concerned about.

The United States was at Bermuda's door in the event of trouble, and if the US decided to invade the Island, who could stop them? Mr. Roberts said cost should not be a factor either against Independence.

National pride should be considered, however.

Mr. Roberts spoke of the pride of Bajans, and told how embarrassed he was by Bermuda's independent status when he travelled to Barbados.

Government backbencher Mr. Harry Soares expressed concern at the way MPs had handled the debate, and the number of cheap personal shots exchanged.

It made him wonder whether Bermuda was really capable of dealing with major issues.

And it also lowered the esteem politicians were held in -- as demonstrated by the public outcry over their salary increases.

"I do believe we have to have somewhat more respect for each other and acknowledge each other's opinions a bit more.'' He added: "Truth is a bit like beauty. It is in the eye of the beholder.'' But it wasn't just enough to be true, said Mr. Soares. One had to be true and fair.

Mr. Soares said the Green Paper appeared to have upset everybody.

It was, however, impossible to please many people with such an emotive and important topic.

And few could argue that the paper had not provoked discussion and thought.

People had read the document, and were taking stands on it, said Mr. Soares.

Mr. Soares said many people asked why Independence had come to the fore.

But he could not fault anyone for bringing the subject forward, and Bermudians, even a minority of them, were entitled to a say.

Mr. Soares said the Premier took the Independence issue to Cabinet and got a consensus to proceed.

It was taken to the UBP Caucus and Sir John received a "very strong consensus'' to go ahead.

"Every member had the opportunity to put their views in Caucus. Some members did not attend, some were overseas, some were late, and some left early.

"There was, however, a very strong overall consensus to go forward. There were probably just two members who strongly objected and said we should not go forward.'' Mr. Soares sparked an outcry from the PLP benches when he said the UBP Caucus reflected the whole Country.

He went on to dismiss Mr. Roberts' suggestion for a meeting between Sir John and Opposition leader Mr. Frederick Wade over a compromise to their different methods of gaining Independence.

"I just can't see it. I don't see how we can have it, as we have fundamental differences.

"When people talk about compromise they really mean `accept my point of view'.'' Mr. Soares said people talked about the importance of stability.

But the real question was: "Through whose eyes do you gauge stability?'' Was it a question of how Bermudians saw themselves, or how others saw them? Mr. Soares said it was wrong for people to attack those who genuinely feared international business could be hit by Independence.

Those who expressed such fears should not be accused of scare-mongering.

"You should try to accept that other people's views can be as sincerely held as your own.'' Mr. Soares said it was a fact that international companies perceived Independence as "potentially negative'', and firms were adopting a "wait and see'' approach.

He said one of his worries was that guest workers who were "advocates'' of Bermuda were now holding fire.

And he knew of one advocate no longer advocating Bermuda.

Capital gains tax -- a tax on profits -- was an additional worry to non-Bermudians who were putting house-buying decisions on hold, warned Mr.

Soares.

Overseas residents were getting very nervous, and delaying property renovations, he said.

"People who are pro-Independence don't want to hear that. But all views must be considered sincere.'' Turning to costs, Mr. Soares said the ones outlined in the Green Paper were just guidelines.

How expensive Independence would be was really something Bermudians controlled.

"Cost is our decision.'' Mr. Soares went on to attack the PLP for constantly calling for "one man, one vote, and votes of equal value''.

The implications of this was that the UBP Government retained power by trickery.

The fact was that the PLP had never mustered more votes than the UBP.

That disproved the contention that the PLP were somehow denied power by boundaries.

Mr. Soares also slammed the Opposition's argument that Independence should be decided by a general election.

Parties fought general elections on a range of issues -- and Independence would be one of many, said Mr. Soares.

He also asked what would voters do if both the PLP and UBP struck an identical Independence stance in their platforms.

Mr. Soares said Government's proposed referendum signified democracy in its purest sense. It amounted to "one vote, one issue'' "One thing I have learned over the years is to respect the opinions of Bermudians. Bermudians have an innate wisdom.'' Mr. Soares said the PLP had also raised the issue of who would be citizens of an independent Bermuda.

At one time there had been talk of the indigenous people being citizens, while those granted status would be forced to apply.

But who were the indigenous people? Maybe the Portuguese were the indigenous people.

In actual fact, the first people on the Island were those of English descent.

It was the English who brought the Portuguese and the blacks to the Island.

"I guess the indigenous people are of English descent,'' said Mr. Soares.

Wrapping up, Mr. Soares said he had noticed how the PLP had been steadily moving towards the UBP's position on a number of issues.

One example was dual citizenship.

The PLP had never brooked dual citizenship, but now suddenly the idea was all right to them.

Perhaps, with Independence, the PLP felt the Premier had taken part of their agenda, and this was the real reason for their opposition to the referendum approach.